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#1 2010-08-19 07:35:40

Pyromancy5
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Rifle Optics: Let you tell me about them

So I purchased My AIA M10-A2 a few months back.  It a SMLE jungle carbine remake that shoots 7.62x39 soviet and accepts an AK magazine.  The rifle I purchased did not come with a scope mount.  I have searched for over a month to find a rail that will fit, or to have one made.  I ended up using two weaver mounts, one in front and one in back.  Both required minor modification to fit and line up correctly.  Now that that project is complete, I need come glass to put on this bad boy.  IDK what to get, I really know nothing about rifle optics. I was thinking a "scout" type scope would be cool, but I am open to anything. I only have two conditions:

1) It cannot have a red or green illuminated reticle (I am color blind, and I can't see these), but blue is OK.
2) It must be under $200 bucks and preferably under $150.

What do you all know about scopes? What do you recommend?


2005 Linear, 5mt, Satin Gray Metallic, moonroof, ixizsclutch, ixizhood, FHI 21 mm rear sway bar, rear dif guard
2014 Nissan Leaf SL, Glacier White, Bose
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#2 2010-08-19 10:45:08

lizzardo
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Re: Rifle Optics: Let you tell me about them

The distance from the eye to the scope is called the eye relief.  For a scout scope, that's going to be about a foot (a quick check showed one was 8.5-14").  If you've already got the mounts in place, and they're on the receiver in the "usual" location, you'll be needing a conventional scope.

What kind of shooting are you anticipating?

The cartridge is not a long distance one, so high magnification won't be needed.  I've started thinking about this same topic, and haven't decided yet.  I'm leaning towards something in the 2-4X, and I prefer fixed magnification rather than adjustable.


A Real Saab and a LeMONS Saab - 1978 99 Turbo and 1979 900 Turbo
A non-SAAB - MV F4 312R - Once, the most mental bike ever made
Jaguar F-Type V6s w/6MT - commuter | 1991 Miata w/Hard top - toy
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#3 2010-08-19 10:57:03

Oodles-Of-Noodles
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Re: Rifle Optics: Let you tell me about them

Pic of said gun.


2005 Deep Blue Mica saab 92x Aero 5-Speed Sports/Cold Package
Just enough Mods to keep driving pleasurable in NoVA. Prodrive/KYB drop. Ixiz. Stealthed Beltronics STi. 4 Horns of Loudness.
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#4 2010-08-19 11:42:52

Pyromancy5
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Re: Rifle Optics: Let you tell me about them

What are the advantages of fixed power over variable.  I am familiar with eye relief. Yeah, the mounts are right over the bolt.  If it was a forward mounted scope, I would do something with a pistol scope, but that is a non issue, because I'm not drilling into this gun.  That was the whole purpose of fabricating these mounts to fit.  I could have had a N04Mk1 SMLE scope mount put on it if I wanted to drill into it.  These guns are too rare in the US to put holes into it.  I'd like to keep it nice.

Edit: My shooting will be out to 200 meters but mostly under

Last edited by Pyromancy5 (2010-08-19 11:50:51)


2005 Linear, 5mt, Satin Gray Metallic, moonroof, ixizsclutch, ixizhood, FHI 21 mm rear sway bar, rear dif guard
2014 Nissan Leaf SL, Glacier White, Bose
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#5 2010-08-19 11:44:03

Pyromancy5
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Re: Rifle Optics: Let you tell me about them

Waiting for Kap to post here...


2005 Linear, 5mt, Satin Gray Metallic, moonroof, ixizsclutch, ixizhood, FHI 21 mm rear sway bar, rear dif guard
2014 Nissan Leaf SL, Glacier White, Bose
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#6 2010-08-19 12:08:35

lizzardo
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Re: Rifle Optics: Let you tell me about them

My preference is for fixed because with adjustable ones, I find that I set it to one magnifacation and don't touch it much after that.  Also, even with what's supposed to be a decent scope, the eye relief does change slightly through the adjustment range.  It seems that adjustable magnification is a big selling point though, based on the relative selection of fixed vs. variable.


A Real Saab and a LeMONS Saab - 1978 99 Turbo and 1979 900 Turbo
A non-SAAB - MV F4 312R - Once, the most mental bike ever made
Jaguar F-Type V6s w/6MT - commuter | 1991 Miata w/Hard top - toy
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#7 2010-08-19 12:10:31

Pyromancy5
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Re: Rifle Optics: Let you tell me about them


2005 Linear, 5mt, Satin Gray Metallic, moonroof, ixizsclutch, ixizhood, FHI 21 mm rear sway bar, rear dif guard
2014 Nissan Leaf SL, Glacier White, Bose
1981 Yamaha SR500

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#8 2010-08-19 12:19:30

Pyromancy5
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Re: Rifle Optics: Let you tell me about them


2005 Linear, 5mt, Satin Gray Metallic, moonroof, ixizsclutch, ixizhood, FHI 21 mm rear sway bar, rear dif guard
2014 Nissan Leaf SL, Glacier White, Bose
1981 Yamaha SR500

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#9 2010-08-19 12:41:25

lizzardo
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Re: Rifle Optics: Let you tell me about them

I'm not sure if the first one would be compatible with your mounts.  Maybe, but I don't know.  It says it goes right on a carry handle and has adaptors for picatinny rails.

I've got a couple of Burris extended eye relief scopes that seem to be fairly well made.  Not sure about the Konus. 

This is making me think about my 7.62x39 AR.  Did I really want to spend more money now?  Damn ...


A Real Saab and a LeMONS Saab - 1978 99 Turbo and 1979 900 Turbo
A non-SAAB - MV F4 312R - Once, the most mental bike ever made
Jaguar F-Type V6s w/6MT - commuter | 1991 Miata w/Hard top - toy
2005 9-2X Linear --> sold | Volvo C30 R-Design 6MT --> sold

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#10 2010-08-19 14:13:39

kap_x
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Re: Rifle Optics: Let you tell me about them

***I haven't read the whole thread, I will have more time to later, so if I say anything that doesn't fit, don't give me shit about it.

Optics are an essential part of a weapon system, and as with anything you get what you pay for.
Now, there are some better than others, naturally, and there are a few decent quality models of glass for a fair price.

If you're going for a scout config, I'd recommend going with a pistol scope as you said.
If you're not limited by a scout config, but still on a tight budget, your three best options are as follows:
Nikon Buckmaster
Simmons AETEC
SWFA Super Sniper (ridiculous name, probably the best optic in the price range and has mil-dot reticle available).

Personally, that's the very low range of what I would get. Naturally you won't be going Nightforce/Schmidt & Bender/Swarovski/etc, but any of the above will serve you well.
I'm not a fan of weaver mounts, but from what you say it might be your only option sans drilling and tapping for mounts.
Remember that a good set of rings is important, too.


Buy from Opticsplanet.com. Great people, great service, great prices. I've bought lots from them, highly recommended.
I'd avoid cheaperthandirt. They are a bunch of cocksmoking swindlers


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Got any pics of the current setup with mounts?


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#11 2010-08-19 15:41:39

Mrmulletmania
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Re: Rifle Optics: Let you tell me about them

BSA makes some decent cheap optics


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#12 2010-08-19 21:01:23

Wagn762
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Re: Rifle Optics: Let you tell me about them

kap said it.
You get what you pay for

Go to your local store and check out some scopes in your price range.  Look through them & see which you like.  The clarity is a huge part of a scope so try not to check them out in one of the box stores where it is nothing but bright florescent lights.

http://www.opticsplanet.net/leupold-rif … scope.html at the top of your price range & you would still need rings but it is a Leupold ( Lifetime Warranty & Waterproof)


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#13 2010-08-19 23:30:47

OldmanTompkins
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Re: Rifle Optics: Let you tell me about them

No way to save up for a bit and get something in the 400-600 range? I have seen a lot of cheap optics fail. I bought a Burris XTR and it has had issues and their customer service sucked bad so I wont  recommend the burris.

Optics are hard since there seems to be very big gaps in pricing and quality.


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#14 2010-08-20 08:50:10

Pyromancy5
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Re: Rifle Optics: Let you tell me about them

I like this one.  A lot.  Anyone want to talk me out of it?

http://www.gunbroker.com/Auction/ViewIt … =185917001


2005 Linear, 5mt, Satin Gray Metallic, moonroof, ixizsclutch, ixizhood, FHI 21 mm rear sway bar, rear dif guard
2014 Nissan Leaf SL, Glacier White, Bose
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#15 2010-08-20 12:40:28

Wagn762
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Re: Rifle Optics: Let you tell me about them

20mm may not have much light transmission.  That would be my concern


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PART OUT 05 Aero no PKGS 5MT ill have to ask what # it was

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#16 2010-08-20 13:39:26

Pyromancy5
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Re: Rifle Optics: Let you tell me about them

I have had 3 pentax cameras and their optics are pretty awesome.  A lot of the lower power scopes dont open back up to a large objective lens.  Leupold zeis and swarovzki all have some that are the same design.  With only a 5x max zoom, I am not terrably concerned with light transmission, that and I rarely if ever shoot in low light conditions.  Most of my time is spent at a range anyways


2005 Linear, 5mt, Satin Gray Metallic, moonroof, ixizsclutch, ixizhood, FHI 21 mm rear sway bar, rear dif guard
2014 Nissan Leaf SL, Glacier White, Bose
1981 Yamaha SR500

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#17 2010-08-20 13:59:52

illzguju
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Re: Rifle Optics: Let you tell me about them

My buddy works for insight, let me know if you want thermal optics  banana

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#18 2010-08-20 14:07:22

kap_x
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Re: Rifle Optics: Let you tell me about them

Check out the Vortex Diamondback & Razor (particularly the razor), too.
They're a fairly new name to optics, but make great stuff, have excellent customer service and an amazing warranty (fully transferable, unlimited lifetime). I have a pair of their binocs an they are fantastic.
They are way underpriced


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#19 2010-08-21 09:42:53

Pyromancy5
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Re: Rifle Optics: Let you tell me about them

I looked at vortex.  I think I'm going to get the Pentax for now. I don't think I will be reaching out beyond 100 years until I up my marksman skills. 5x will be enough for my needs here.  I do like those though, but the Razor HD ones were like 1500 bucks man.  I'm going to save some dough and think on it.  it's hard to spend 700 on a gun and justify twice as much on a scope especially when it's a carbine.  and 762 is not going to be super accurate out at 300 yards out of a 21 inch barrel


2005 Linear, 5mt, Satin Gray Metallic, moonroof, ixizsclutch, ixizhood, FHI 21 mm rear sway bar, rear dif guard
2014 Nissan Leaf SL, Glacier White, Bose
1981 Yamaha SR500

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#20 2010-08-26 01:42:45

kap_x
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Re: Rifle Optics: Let you tell me about them

The EOTech 4xs are way overpriced, but they're quality.

LaRue Tactical used to sell a "Po' Boy" magnifier as an option with their flip-to-side mount. It was a cut down Hendsoldt/Zeiss 2x optic for $200 bucks. Looked fairly ugly, but Hendsoldt/Zeiss is great glass.


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#21 2010-08-26 02:10:21

kap_x
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Re: Rifle Optics: Let you tell me about them

They're definitely quality, but for the price of an EOTech + magnifier, I'd go with an ACOG big_smile


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#22 2010-08-26 04:01:19

Pyromancy5
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Re: Rifle Optics: Let you tell me about them

Got my Pentax in the mail yesterday.  I like it alot.  It has nice optics.  really good in good light, and not bad in low light especially considering the 20mm objective lens.  It's a step above the Tascos and Bushnells and maybe 2 of the cheaper Nikons that I looked at in stores.  I like the "Percision Plex" reticle which is a balistic reticle for bullet drop., but I cant find any information on how it translates to MOA.  Any suggestions on how to find this out?  and before you ask, yes, I already looked on Pentax's website.


2005 Linear, 5mt, Satin Gray Metallic, moonroof, ixizsclutch, ixizhood, FHI 21 mm rear sway bar, rear dif guard
2014 Nissan Leaf SL, Glacier White, Bose
1981 Yamaha SR500

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#23 2010-08-27 05:03:34

Pyromancy5
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Re: Rifle Optics: Let you tell me about them

sorry I have not posted pics.  My compy is dead right now.  I mounted the scope.  It looks good, but the specs said eye relief was 3" at the highest magnification, but it is really 2".  This sucks for me.  The stock is already on the larger side of what I would call comfortable for my size (I prefer a youth model shotgun for skeet and trap) as I am 5'5".  I like to have my shoulder forward in a more agressive stance when shooting, but this is not pissible with this scope.  I have mounted it as far back as it will go, and now I don't know what to do with it.  I am going to the range today to see how well it works while I am shooting.  I may need to find a scope with 4 or 5 inches of eye relief.


2005 Linear, 5mt, Satin Gray Metallic, moonroof, ixizsclutch, ixizhood, FHI 21 mm rear sway bar, rear dif guard
2014 Nissan Leaf SL, Glacier White, Bose
1981 Yamaha SR500

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#24 2010-08-27 11:21:54

lizzardo
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Re: Rifle Optics: Let you tell me about them

I'm sorry to hear it's not what you'd hoped for.  That's my biggest gripe with adjustable scopes.  The eye relief changes enough through the range that I have to adjust my head position. 

I'm going to try a scout scope setup on an SKS this weekend, if the parts show up today as expected.  I've got a 2 3/4X and a 4X.  Not sure which will be better.  For the 7.62x39, possibly the lower power.  We'll see.


A Real Saab and a LeMONS Saab - 1978 99 Turbo and 1979 900 Turbo
A non-SAAB - MV F4 312R - Once, the most mental bike ever made
Jaguar F-Type V6s w/6MT - commuter | 1991 Miata w/Hard top - toy
2005 9-2X Linear --> sold | Volvo C30 R-Design 6MT --> sold

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#25 2010-08-27 13:22:52

Pyromancy5
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Re: Rifle Optics: Let you tell me about them

I should be at the range with in the hour.  if it's not comfortable to shoot I will return it and see what else will work for me.  From what I can tell, 5x should be a good amount of magnification.  I have a 4x on my .22 and it's meh.  Any more than 5x may be overkill if it is not adjustable.


2005 Linear, 5mt, Satin Gray Metallic, moonroof, ixizsclutch, ixizhood, FHI 21 mm rear sway bar, rear dif guard
2014 Nissan Leaf SL, Glacier White, Bose
1981 Yamaha SR500

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